Dr Louise Newson: [01:00:00] This podcast is really important for everybody to listen to. It's about PMDD, premenstrual dysphoric disorder. I have Jenny with me who has PMDD and she has struggled for far too many years. She's not been believed, she's not being listened to, she's been given antidepressants, she had a hysterectomy. No-one thought about hormones. She's done this amazing picture that we talk through showing the contrast between the good days and the bad days of having PMDD. It's a really common condition. It's the more severe form of premenstrual syndrome, but premenstrual syndrome is still not understood enough. It's not talked about enough and it's certainly not treated well enough with the right hormones. So listen to this, share this episode with as many people as you know, because it could, not just change lives, but save lives too.  [01:00:49][49.4]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:00:52] Jenny you are here.  [01:00:53][0.7]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:00:53] I am.  [01:00:53][0.3]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:00:55]  In real life. You've come down from Stockport, you've got your mother for moral support. It's a big thing that you're here.  [01:01:00][4.9]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:01:00] Yeah.  [01:01:00][0.0]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:01:01] And I'm really excited to be talking about PMDD, which most people don't know what it is, although it's been around forever. It has been called different things. So premenstrual dysphoric disorder. It's a more severe form of PMS, premenstrual syndrome. There's lots of academics will argue and discuss how to diagnose it. But for most women, it just means they're having a really difficult time throughout their menstrual cycle, usually before their periods. And you have had a really difficult time and you're here to talk about it because you are feeling better and you are getting better all the time, which is wonderful. So do you mind, it's not easy I know, but do you just mind talking a bit about what's happened?  [01:01:48][47.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:01:49] So I went to my GP for years and years with depression symptoms, and they kept giving me, I think I tried every antidepressant that there was and none of them really did anything. But I kept saying, it feels like it's in relation to my cycle. But they were like, no, no. Because my periods were regular. They were like no, it can't be anything to do with your hormones. So this went on for years and years.  [01:02:15][26.2]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:02:15] So when did that start?  [01:02:16][0.7]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:02:17] I'd say around... 2006 ish.  [01:02:22][5.2]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:02:22] So how old were you then?  [01:02:23][0.8]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:02:24] I was in my 20s. Looking back, I think I could have had it since I was a teenager. And then I was seeing a regular counsellor through a charity that's near our house. After my son was born asleep, this charity were really good. And because I was seing her once a week, she picked up on the cycle. She picked up it. And I have chronic fatigue syndrome, so I was seeing an ME nurse as well. She also picked up on it and she was the one that printed the document out and said please go take that to your GP I think that's when it was PMDD and when I read it I couldn't believe it.  [01:03:04][40.3]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:03:05] Because it all made sense, yeah.  [01:03:07][2.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:03:06] Yeah, it was me. So I took that to the GP and they agreed to refer me to a gynaecologist at that point.  [01:03:14][7.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:03:15] And what symptoms were you getting?  [01:03:15][0.9]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:03:16] It was more the mood symptoms that I struggled with the most. The worst one was the feeling, like not wanting to be here anymore. It started where it was about maybe one week of the month, but as it got more towards the end, I was feeling like that three weeks of the month.  [01:03:33][16.7]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:03:34] Three weeks of a month you were feeling like you didn't want to be there? [01:03:36][2.5]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:03:36] Yeah and then it would hit and then I'd feel okay and then it would hit me again and it was just a constant cycle of, and it was the feelings like not feeling good enough and a lot of mine I would say were mental but also another one of the symptoms is binge eating which I was struggling with, which actually turned into an eating disorder I think because my the PMDD was left so long. So then that was like another thing to battle.  [01:04:07][30.7]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:04:08] That's really hard and we know with the hormonal changes our hormones work in every cell of our body so they affect our brains, so the mood the irritability some people get very angry as well but then also it can affect our metabolism and people can get changes in their insulin and glucose as well and a lot of people listening will I'm sure have had times where they have sugar cravings.  [01:04:31][23.1]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:04:32] Yeah.  [01:04:32][0.0]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:04:33] In those days before your periods and all you want to do is think about food and you know I've had it, we've all had it but then suddenly realise oh yes my period's come I don't feel like the same with food but if it's more extreme for some people like you say it can really affect the way that you eat can't it? [01:04:48][15.1]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:04:49] Mine got to a point where it wasn't that, it was, someone explained it as like a form of self-harm so and it wasn't that I didn't want to eat healthy it was my head was telling me I wasn't good enough to eat an orange or to eat fruit or salad, it was no you need to eat food that's gonna harm. You know like I wasn't good enough, so it wasn't t just that I ate a lot or there a lot more...  [01:05:15][26.3]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:05:16] More than that. And that's really important to talk about actually because we know that a lot of women with PMDD and PMDD affects, we don't know the amount because a lot people aren't diagnosed, but it at least 5% which is a lot one in 20 women probably more and some studies have shown around 80% of people with PMDD self-harm. And you can self harm in different ways as you've just described to me, eating and for some people they can physically harm themselves as well, can't they? [01:05:47][32.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:05:49] Yeah, I've heard of people that do. I think my head was doing it in a way that people couldn't see, apart from the weight it wasn't something that people, there was no physical marks or... I think, my head, was trying to hide what was going on in front of other people.  [01:06:06][17.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:06:07] And then did you have any other symptoms that didn't affect your mental health? So any palpitations?  [01:06:12][4.8]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:06:14] Looking back now, there were things that the doctors looked into, which looking back now was probably the PMDD, like the heart pounding, even like the chest, like anxiety, like flutters, and aches and pains as well. I've been diagnosed with fibromyalgia, but...  [01:06:35][20.2]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:06:36] How much is related, yeah. [01:06:37][1.1]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:06:38] The more you learn about PMDD, it affects so much of your body. [01:06:41][3.2]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:06:42] That's exactly it. Did you get any skin changes, any skin dryness or itchiness or anything? [01:06:47][5.1]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:06:46] I do get itchiness and dryness, but I have mast cell activation as well and my hormones affected that.  [01:06:54][8.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:06:59] It's the whole balance of hormones that's so important and many people will know the graph that we're often taught at school where people get a little surge of hormones when we ovulate in the middle of our cycle then we get a surge in the second half it's called the luteal phase where we get higher amounts of estrogen, estradiol but also very high levels of progesterone that then fall very quickly and that fall very quickly can trigger symptoms for a lot of people. And often people have underplayed, really, the power of hormones. And when, years ago, you might know, in the 1960s, a doctor called Katharina Dalton coined the term premenstrual syndrome. And she wrote about it and she talked a lot about PMDD, premenstrual dysphoric disorder. And she gave a lot of women natural hormones, especially progesterone. She lectured on it. Lots of people came to her clinic. Really, she transformed a lot of people's lives. But a lot people didn't like the way she was lecturing. They thought she didn't know much. She was 'only' in  inverted commas, a GP. And the antidepressants were coming into play. And the psychiatrist decided to label it a psychiatric disorder. And Prozac, you know, the antidespressant Prozac was green. And they made one that was pink and purple, specifically for PMDD.  [01:08:24][84.9]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:08:26] Oh, that's...  [01:08:26][0.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:08:26] It's awful, isn't it?  [01:08:27][0.7]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:08:27] That's frightening.  [01:08:27][0.2]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:08:28] It's really frightening. And so then it became a psychiatric disorder. Now, it's very likely related to changing hormones. Our hormones work everywhere. And one of the things, as you know, in the clinic, we ask people lots and lots of symptoms and we've increased it. So it's the same as a symptom questionnaire on Balance. And a lot of those are other symptoms. So like you say, the palpitations, skin changes, urinary symptoms and so forth.  [01:08:57][29.5]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:08:58] Oh, that was a big one for me. Sorry, actually I forgot, yeah.  [01:09:00][2.9]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:09:01] And so if people have all these other symptoms, it's very hard for me as a doctor to say it's all depression or it's all a psychiatric condition. Because if it's in your brain, your heart and your bladder and your muscles shouldn't really be affected. But sometimes in medicine, doctors don't ask the right questions so then you don't get all the right answers. [01:09:20][19.4]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:09:22] No, they just concentrate on one thing rather than looking at the bigger picture and that's one thing I've learnt, we need to have open eyes and look at the bigger picture. I know professionals struggle with time and things but it makes such a difference.  [01:09:35][13.8]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:09:37] Absolutely. So you've seen lots of different healthcare professionals, haven't you?  [01:09:40][3.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:09:41] Yeah, lots.  [01:09:42][0.6]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:09:43] And you've not always got the best advice from them either, have you?  [01:09:45][2.4]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:09:47] So when I got referred to the gynaecologist she did some ultrasound scans, she was brilliant at the beginning and then they put me on the waiting list, they decided I was having a hysterectomy. That was...  [01:10:02][14.1]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:10:01] To remove your ovaries as well?  [01:10:03][1.5]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:10:04] Yes, they actually gave me Prostap. [01:10:06][1.8]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:10:08] Yeah, so that's to block, it's a hormone blocker, isn't it?  [01:10:11][2.9]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:10:11] Chemical menopause. So they gave me that but after two injections or two months it affected my blood pressure so they took me off it.  [01:10:18][7.1]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:10:18] What, your blood pressure went up? [01:10:19][1.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:10:20] It went really high, yeah.  [01:10:21][1.1]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:10:21] That's because, I'm sure you know, you don't have your natural hormones, which help reduce and lower your blood pressures.   [01:10:27][6.6]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:10:28] So it was through the roof, like dangerously high so they took me off it. I did in the short time I was on it I did see improvements and because of that they said we'll put you on the waiting list for a hysterectomy that's the best option for you so I went onto the waiting list, there was a COVID was a factor in it as well but I was on the waiting list two years and in that time there was, I was coping with the PMDD. I was waiting to see an eating disorder specialist who told me I wasn't allowed to be on any diets until I'd had the treatment. And this consultant was telling me to lose weight for my surgery. I was like stuck in between two professionals. And this went on for two years. And after the two years, I got to took off the waiting list because of my BMI. And this doctor knew that I was, see, I can use this word now. I've never been able to use it until recently. I told this doctor that I was suicidal for three weeks of the month and she did, there was no compassion, she just kept going on about my weight, and then when I questioned this I was told that they are trained in gynaecology, not mental health, so they don't know what to do with what I told them about feeling suicidal, and that's one thing that made me want to do my awareness, because I've got, I'm lucky I've really good family and friends to support me, but not everybody does. And that could have really tipped somebody over the edge. So it's just looking at the bigger picture again.  [01:12:04][96.2]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:12:05] So how did you manage to find somebody to help you with your hormones?  [01:12:08][3.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:12:08] At this point, I went to see a private gynaecologist, which was hard because I was already struggling because I'd not been able to work.  [01:12:16][8.1]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:12:17] Yeah, of course.  [01:12:17][0.4]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:12:18] I think I'd worked for about four years up to this point. And this gynaecologist, he put me on Zolodex.  [01:12:24][6.4]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:12:25] Another hormone blocker.  [01:12:26][0.7]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:12:26] Another hormone, which does the same as the Prostap. So he put me on that, and my blood pressure was ok. So they kept me on that. And he was a lot talking about my mental health as well until I went back two months later and he looked PMDD up, and he apologised because he said he genuinely didn't know the effects of it. And that was him apologising, was actually quite nice because it made me... [01:12:54][27.4]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:12:55] Validates you more doesn't it?  [01:12:56][1.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:12:57] Yeah, and that's what made me want to do my awareness as well because he was a gynaecologist and he didn't know about it and it just gave me a bit of a lightbulb moment. I thought if gynaecologists don't understand it, we're not going to get the right treatments are we because that's who you get referred to. So he gave me the Zolodex for a while and then because he knew like I was struggling with money wise and he helped me as much as he could because he know how I'd been treated and he transferred me back to the NHS to another consultant and he couldn't have referred me to a better one, he was lovely, the consultant, yeah he was lovely and the day of my surgery was the calmest day.  [01:13:38][41.6]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:13:39] Nice.  [01:13:39][0.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:13:40] But I didn't know you then but since I've learned things from you, hysterectomy, there might have been other options to not have gone down such a serious route.  [01:13:51][11.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:13:52] Yes.  [01:13:52][0.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:13:52] There could have been other options. They could have tried with the HRT and other hormones, couldn't they, I think, from what I've learned from you? [01:13:59][6.4]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:14:00] Yes, but you don't know what you don't know, that's the problem, and now you are taking some hormones, aren't you? Some natural hormones.  [01:14:05][5.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:14:05] Well, even after my hysterectomy I was told after six weeks you go on HRT, so six weeks came and the first six weeks I actually felt incredible. But then, maybe about week seven, everything changed and I thought the PMDD was coming back, which confused me because I'm like, how can it come back, everything's gone? And then I contacted my GP and they were like, we'll just wait for the hospital. Anyway, it got to about three months and I still hadn't been given any HRT. And then they finally gave me a patch, which wasn't doing anything at all. And it wasn't until I found you and you've helped me with different hormones.  [01:14:53][47.2]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:15:11] It's really interesting and important, actually, that people realise this because I see it a lot with any hormonal imbalance, but especially with PMDD, because people, in some ways rightly think the hormones are to blame. Let's just remove the ovaries and then we won't have hormones. Now, there's a couple of problems with that. One is that our hormones are made in other organs, not just our ovaries. They're made in our adrenal glands. They're in our brain. You can't take out your adrenal glands, you can take out your brain. So it will help some of the imbalance, but not all. But the other thing is, a lot of people have the symptoms because of the change in hormone levels. And our hormones are really, really beneficial for us as well. They have lots of beneficial effects and you're young as well, you know, you want hormones for your bones and your heart and future health. And so it's a very sort of wrongly too simplistic thing to remove the hormones. I remember years ago, it must have been about eight or nine years ago a 74-year-old lady came to see me in the clinic and she had more sort of PMS, maybe PMDD, I mean the symptoms are similar, it's just the severity really, but she'd had a hysterectomy when she was in her 40s but she said every month I still get symptoms, she said at the beginning of the month I get a drop in the mood, I get anxiety, I get palpitations and I remember listening to her and thinking well she's had her ovaries removed, why is that? But I've always been taught to listen and believe your patients. So I thought, I've got to understand more. And then I realised, well, of course, her brain has got these cyclical hormonal changes going on. So of course it's right. And I gave her hormones because I said, well, I'm not sure about these changes, but I'll give you hormones for your bones and your future health and might help your symptoms. And she came back a few months later. She said, I feel amazing. I wish I'd done this years ago. So then I thought, well, we shouldn't just be blocking hormones. We shouldn't be giving these hormone blockers or removing ovaries without talking about having those hormones back. And a lot of women with PMDD, once you get the level of hormones and the same all the time, because that's the big difference.  [01:17:22][131.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:17:23] It's the ups and downs...  [01:17:23][0.3]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:17:23] Yeah, yeah. And for you, there were more downs than ups. For some people, it's just a few days. But for you it was the majority of the month.  [01:17:31][7.6]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:17:32] Because it did get longer as time went on so I don't know if it's because it had been going on so long with me  [01:17:36][4.4]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:17:36] Often can be, can't it? Yeah. And it's really hard sometimes in medicine when we have a patient in front of us, we focus on what's happening on that day, if you see what I mean. And one of the things I've really learnt when I'm trying to work out whether it's hormones or not, is just ask the patient, do you feel the same every day of your cycle? And if someone had asked you that many years ago, once you'd worked it out yourself. It was very clear that you didn't feel the same every day of your cycle.  [01:18:08][31.7]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:18:08] Yeah.  [01:18:08][0.0]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:18:09] And that's what I think all doctors and nurses and pharmacists and healthcare professionals should be asking anybody with any mental health symptoms because so often people are focusing on just today's symptoms and not putting it into context and then they're forgetting about hormones. [01:18:29][19.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:18:31] Yeah. I think it goes down to being listened to again.  [01:18:35][3.8]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:18:37] Absolutely.  [01:18:37][0.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:18:37] I don't feel like I was listened to, at all. And then when they decided on the hysterectomy, I was made to think I'd have the hysterectomy and life would be rosy. And I think if I'd not met you, I'd still be struggling with the patch, that wasn't, like when you did the blood test just along with my symptoms. And you said I've not had any hormones for, I think it was 18 months to two years.  [01:19:03][26.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:19:05] And how old were you when you had your hysterectomy?  [01:19:06][1.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:19:07] It was two years ago, so 41.  [01:19:08][1.4]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:19:09] So young.  [01:19:09][0.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:19:10] Yeah. And even maybe this might help someone else. When you put me on progesterone, I was a bit wary at first, because when I was put on the Pill, which they put me on to try and help, it made me worse so much worse. And I was made to think I had a problem with progesterone. So when you suggested it...  [01:19:30][19.6]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:19:31] You were really nervouse weren't you? [01:19:31][0.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:19:31] I was really nervous and I honestly cannot believe I had two weeks where I couldn't take it because there was a problem with my prescription and I could tell. It's made such a massive difference. So with other ladies are worried about taking it. Give it a try. [01:19:45][14.0]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:19:45] It's really important, and thank you for saying that, because what happens is a lot of people call the synthetic progestogens, progesterone, because it used to be called the progesterone only pill, whereas progesterone is the hormone that we make ourselves. And obviously you're taking now on prescription, but it's a very different substance to the synthetic progestogens. And so a lot people, especially with PMDD, have quite severe side effects with progestogens. Either they've had them as contraception or they might have had the mini pill or the implant or a Depo or use a synthetic hormonal coil. So then they get quite scared. And then a lot of people think, well, if you've had a hysterectomy, you don't need progesterone.  [01:20:29][43.4]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:20:29] Yeah, I was told I only needed estrogen. I didn't need testosterone or progesterone.  [01:20:35][5.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:20:36] Which is crazy, really, because our hormones, progesterone and testosterone, as well as estradiol, are made in the ovaries. So to have your ovaries removed, your hormones, although they're made elsewhere, would have been lowered. And so having the natural progestorone at the right dose can make a real difference. And what's very frustrating for me, as you know, I spend a lot of my time frustrated, is that even in the 1960s, it was known that progesterone, the natural progestorone, is a really beneficial treatment for PMDD. Yet, it's not given first line.  [01:21:14][37.7]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:21:16] Not given... no. So yeah, if that was prescribed that could have avoided major surgery and years of trauma. And it was having this surgery as well, and being on the waiting list that caused so much trauma.  [01:21:26][10.3]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:21:26] Of course. Yeah, yeah. And that's a lot for a lot of women, you know, even the guidelines as you know for PMDD don't mention natural hormones.  [01:21:35][8.8]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:21:36] No, they don't. No.  [01:21:37][1.0]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:21:38] It's crazy, isn't it?  [01:21:38][0.9]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:21:39] Yeah, it's just the chemical menopause and hysterectomy that's...  [01:21:42][3.1]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:21:42] Or antidepressants.  [01:21:43][0.3]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:21:43] Or antidespressants, yeah.  [01:21:44][0.9]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:21:44] So have you given antidepresants?  [01:21:45][0.5]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:21:46] Throughout the years, I think I've tried every antidepresant going and none of them.  [01:21:50][3.9]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:21:50] No.  [01:21:50][0.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:21:51] I'd say none of them. Some of them maybe took the edge off, but...  [01:21:54][3.4]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:21:56] Didn't do anything dramatic.  [01:21:56][0.6]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:21:56] No, no, not at all.  [01:21:58][1.6]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:21:58] So it's very hard also for family members isn't it? It's not just for the individual who's got PMDD.  [01:22:05][6.5]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:22:06] No, because in my story that I've done for my awareness I've put in there I feel like it robbed my children of their mum, my husband of his wife and my parents of their daughter and it's cost me a lot of my life really. It's robbed me of my time with my children and as much as we've done things in our own way it has robbed a big part of the life really, their mum in their life.  [01:22:34][28.3]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:22:35] Yeah and you're doing a lot of awareness.  [01:22:37][2.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:22:38] I'm trying.  [01:22:38][0.2]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:22:39] So you've done this picture which is just brilliant and I've shown it in loads of presentations and it's called Hormone Health and there's a picture of a womb and it's two sides isn't it? So I'm just going to read some of the words. I mean it's the bigger part says suicidal thoughts on one side. And then you've got paranoid, weight gain, depression, cramps, fatigue, bloating, migraine, anxiety. It goes on this side. And then you got a rainbow and living life to the full, which is what we should all be doing. I mean, life is not good every day for everybody. That's just not life, but you've got smile, enjoy, relax, social, function, self care, energy, calm, kind. These are all really really important words and it's a real black and white isn't it?  [01:23:39][60.5]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:23:40] Yeah.  [01:23:40][0.0]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:23:40] It's like night and day which is what so many people say to me the difference.  [01:23:43][3.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:23:44] The difference yeah. It is.  [01:23:45][0.6]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:23:45] So if you had a mental health condition this would be there all the time.  [01:23:50][4.6]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:23:51] Yeah.  [01:23:51][0.0]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:23:52] But you had glimmers of this.  [01:23:52][0.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:23:53] Yeah, I think that's what makes it harder as well, having the glimmers and then being hit by a brick wall.  [01:23:59][5.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:24:01] Yes, yeah.  [01:24:01][0.2]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:24:01] It's just constant.  [01:24:01][0.1]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:24:02] And I know having spoken to many people with PMDD, even when you're the rainbow side, you've got the other side hanging over you because you know it's going to come. So which is really difficult, isn't it?  [01:24:14][12.3]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:24:14] You know it's coming yes, your'e just waiting. It's like a wave, waiting for the wave to come and knock you over.  [01:24:18][4.0]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:24:19] So I spoke to someone at the weekend, I did a consultation and she's had PMDD and she was in her mid-20s and she couldn't sit her exams, her A levels, because they came when her, just before her periods. So then she couldn get into the university that she wanted to. She couldn't get the job she wanted to. She's under a gynaecologist who said, well, I think you should have a hysterectomy. She hasn't had children, she doesn't know whether she wants them. And they said or we could give you two coils together, Mirena coils, and put two in together and that might help some of your bleeding. And she doesn't like the synthetic progestogens. So she said she didn't want that. And they say, well, they are your options. So I worry about younger people because they're not reaching their potential. You know, you've been really lovely and great and honest about the impact it's had on your personal family life. But the only way I think we can change is awareness. And choice. And I'm not here saying we can't have these other treatments, but we have to think about the basics and hormones as well and the balance of those hormones. You know, you've had a difficult time, but you are improving, which is wonderful.  [01:25:32][72.9]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:25:33] Yes, I'm not to the point of living life to the full, but I am on my way.  [01:25:37][3.0]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:25:37] But you're on your way and you've come down here.  [01:25:39][2.1]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:25:40] I can see the road ahead now,.  [01:25:41][1.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:25:42] Which you couldn't before.  [01:25:42][0.5]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:25:43] I didn't even want to wake up in the morning. And now I can see the light is on its way.  [01:25:49][6.4]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:25:50] Yeah.  [01:25:50][0.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:25:50] Well, that wouldn't have been possible without you.  [01:25:52][1.7]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:25:52] Yeah. Ahh. [01:25:52][0.1]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:25:52] Because if you'd not done the HRT, I would still be struggling.  [01:25:55][2.7]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:25:57] Yes, and you've come a two-hour train journey into London, it's a massive thing. I can't even overestimate how much it's been for you to come here.  [01:26:06][9.3]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:26:06] Yes, It's been a big deal.  [01:26:07][0.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:26:07] And you've done so well, but it's so important because, you know, you can learn from me as a doctor but actually I learn so much from patients and other people need to learn from real life scenarios because it will resonate and I know your story will resonate with a lot of people.  [01:26:23][16.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:26:24] I think because it's so real as well.  [01:26:26][1.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:26:26] Yeah. It's so real but also you're getting better because you've got the right balance of hormones and the motivation and now the knowledge and the reassurance as well.  [01:26:35][9.6]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:26:36] I think I'm on the right HRT as well. I can function a bit better, so if I can function a little bit better if I can help myself a bit more.  [01:26:42][6.3]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:26:43] Absolutely, they all go together.  [01:26:44][1.0]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:26:45] Before I couldn't function at all. [01:26:45][0.6]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:26:46] It's so important we're doing a lot of work about PMDD through Balance app as well because the more people that have that knowledge to share the better. Your work is so important too. So before we end I always ask for three take-home tips. So there might be people listening today who either think oh my goodness I've got PMS or PMDD it actually doesn't matter in the respect that the treatment is still with hormones. So they might have PMDD or they might think, goodness me, that's my daughter, that my niece, that's a colleague at work. So what three things, Jenny, do you think would be important for people to know when they're just learning about PMDD?  [01:27:28][42.3]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:27:29] Firstly, to make sure  that you speak to someone, your family maybe first and speak to them about how you're feeling just so they're aware and that might help them help you a little bit. But don't give up with professionals, keep going if you have to go to your GP, keep going. Don't let them make you feel like, I felt really dismissed, don't let them do that because, don't give up and you're in I was told I wasn't entitled to a second opinion, but since then I have learned you are entitled to second opinion.  [01:28:03][33.2]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:28:03] And a third and a fourth.  [01:28:04][0.6]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:28:05] Yeah, so don't let them say no and make you feel like giving up. Keep going, you'll find someone that will listen. It might take, hopefully by this podcast, it might not take as long, but you will find somebody that will listen, it might take a few professionals, but you'll find someone.  [01:28:24][19.8]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:28:26] Really important. Really important to advocate for yourself, to speak up, to listen, but to share.  [01:28:31][5.1]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:28:31] Really hard when you're in that. It really is. But yeah, you need to be brave enough to, which is hard but...  [01:28:42][10.9]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:28:44] Absolutely. So thank you so much. I'm so grateful that you've come today and I know this podcast will help so many people. So, thank you.  [01:28:51][7.7]
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Jenny Potkins: [01:28:52] Thank you for asking me.  [01:28:53][0.5]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:28:53] Thank You.  [01:28:53][0.3]
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Dr Louise Newson: [01:28:56] Thanks so much for listening. It would be amazing if you could follow me or subscribe because it will really make a difference to grow numbers, enable this to reach even more people. Thanks so much. [01:28:56]

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